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Post by merasmag on May 15, 2023 14:58:37 GMT -5
first of all...this doesn't sound like a HUGE overage to me...what are the highest levels ever found in a "milkshaked" horselet? secondly...this reminds me of the olden days quite comparable to palace intrique...alliances, suspicions, plottings, innuendo and scapegoats to protect the powers that be---paulick writes:
"Still, the trainer had no explanation for how the horse's TCO2 was so elevated. “I do not know,” he said. “The only thing I can say, and I don't want to go into detail, our feed program has been the same for 10 years and we've never had a problem. This was a new horse in the barn.” Prior to the Bath House Row Stakes, Aristocracy was campaigned by his breeders, Gary and Mary West, and trained by Brad Cox. He ran ninth in his previous start, the March 4 John Battaglia Memorial Stakes at Turfway Park, before joining the Diodoro barn for a new owner." how long do a strong milkshake's effects last? how long to remove all traces of long-term milkshaking?
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Post by mysaladdays on May 15, 2023 15:36:42 GMT -5
I wouldn't claim a horse off Diodoro if my life depended on it.
As for all this "splitting of hairs", if we don't get the drugs out of US Racing, sooner than later, we can just continue with conjecture, guessing games, etc.
(analogy) We can continue to be distracted by the trees, when the forest itelf is riddled with tree-eating insects which eventually makes a lot of trees rot and fall down.
Rulings have to come down quicker .....
.. that guy Linder said that he still hasn't been paid purse money for that race where he ran 2nd to the pletcher horse......and that race was way back in Dec 2022. It's now May 2023.......I see no ruling on this at all in Owner's View Rulings.
We put a man on the moon decades ago.......seems like the technology to do these things isn't as complex as "rocket science"?
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Post by merasmag on May 15, 2023 16:06:57 GMT -5
i'd ask who u would claim off of but i don't want u to hurt urself i forgot gossip and backstabbing now i will go into my preakness coccoon...
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Post by mysaladdays on May 15, 2023 16:35:32 GMT -5
i'd ask who u would claim off of but i don't want u to hurt urself The %'s I'm seeing with many claiming trainers sits uneasily with me. I like to remind people who extol these super high percentage trainers [in bursts] that The Chief [Allen Jerkens] and the Bald Eagle [Charlie Wittingham], two of the very best ever, ever............. never reached those exalted heights. Either do many truly respectable HOF trainers. So to answer your question, the answer is probably.......none. If we got rid of claiming races altogether, I would not shed any tears. That's just my personal opinion. Admittedly I don't earn my living in a claiming barn, so again, JMHO.
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Post by merasmag on May 15, 2023 17:40:04 GMT -5
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Post by merasmag on May 15, 2023 23:37:16 GMT -5
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ozzy
UpInClass Member
Posts: 850
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Post by ozzy on May 16, 2023 10:13:28 GMT -5
first of all...this doesn't sound like a HUGE overage to me...what are the highest levels ever found in a "milkshaked" horselet? secondly...this reminds me of the olden days quite comparable to palace intrique...alliances, suspicions, plottings, innuendo and scapegoats to protect the powers that be---paulick writes: "Still, the trainer had no explanation for how the horse's TCO2 was so elevated. “I do not know,” he said. “The only thing I can say, and I don't want to go into detail, our feed program has been the same for 10 years and we've never had a problem. This was a new horse in the barn.” Prior to the Bath House Row Stakes, Aristocracy was campaigned by his breeders, Gary and Mary West, and trained by Brad Cox. He ran ninth in his previous start, the March 4 John Battaglia Memorial Stakes at Turfway Park, before joining the Diodoro barn for a new owner." how long do a strong milkshake's effects last? how long to remove all traces of long-term milkshaking? I would suggest researching "milkshaking" a bit.... First, the thought of any non-veterinarian trying to insert a nasogastric tube is a frightening thought. I've participating in hundreds of gastroscopies with talented and trained veterinary professionals with many struggling with getting correct placement into the espophagus to enter the stomach, versus the trachea which leads to the lungs. And that is when aided by a high quality camera to help differentiate the pathways! An untrained professional doing so blindly is more than a bit scary.... TCO2 increases or decreases in response to electrolyte or protein changes in the body. If something increases, something else goes down in response. This is the "intent" of milkshaking.... increasing a dose of sodium ions with bicarbonate (via baking soda) in the hopes of elevating TCO2 and reducing lactate produced when the horse begins to experience muscle fatigue from exercise. Lactate build up is what gives us the "burn" during exercise... I digress from further explanation as I'm having flashbacks to college biochemistry..... Bottom line, no one is sure it actually works as it likely isn't readily bioavailable or effective, it's a thick, slurry substance which can be deadly if delivered incorrectly to the horse's lungs/airway, and probably isn't great for the horse's GI system either....
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Post by merasmag on May 16, 2023 19:18:24 GMT -5
what? who said anything about "non-vets" doing anything? this is commonly called "a red herring"
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ozzy
UpInClass Member
Posts: 850
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Post by ozzy on May 16, 2023 19:41:27 GMT -5
what? who said anything about "non-vets" doing anything? this is commonly called "a red herring" I am not saying you said it and not saying it doesn’t happen, but in most cases no veterinarian is going to administer a NG tube to a horse in training containing the ingredients of a “milkshake” with the knowledge there horse is soon to run. I’d say it is even less likely in a jurisdiction in which regular out of competition testing occurs, thus is is most commonly done by “non-vets.” Not a red herring, just a simple application of If, then logic if I correctly recall my Philosophy 101 course from 30 years ago….
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Post by merasmag on May 16, 2023 22:22:47 GMT -5
what? who said anything about "non-vets" doing anything? this is commonly called "a red herring" I am not saying you said it and not saying it doesn’t happen, but in most cases no veterinarian is going to administer a NG tube to a horse in training containing the ingredients of a “milkshake” with the knowledge there horse is soon to run. I’d say it is even less likely in a jurisdiction in which regular out of competition testing occurs, thus is is most commonly done by “non-vets.” Not a red herring, just a simple application of If, then logic if I correctly recall my Philosophy 101 course from 30 years ago…. sounds a lot like what diodoro said and logic classes 4 freshmen are inherently flawed if...then...lol
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Post by cherokeescot on May 17, 2023 12:29:36 GMT -5
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1hooper
UpInClass Steward
Posts: 6,746
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Post by 1hooper on May 17, 2023 12:56:31 GMT -5
At least one vet is talking. Will be a Cal trainer announced next.
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Post by merasmag on May 17, 2023 22:52:55 GMT -5
At least one vet is talking. Will be a Cal trainer announced next. would u like to inform us plebes who u are talking about? why should the gossip stay as gossip? sum of us REAL bettors would like to manage our money properly why shood i have to just guess it's baffert that can't race at belmont?
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ozzy
UpInClass Member
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Post by ozzy on May 18, 2023 7:11:17 GMT -5
At least one vet is talking. Will be a Cal trainer announced next. Are you referring to a recent bad test in KY?
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1hooper
UpInClass Steward
Posts: 6,746
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Post by 1hooper on May 18, 2023 8:55:00 GMT -5
Derby Day.
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Post by mysaladdays on May 18, 2023 9:42:59 GMT -5
"Mr Robertson advised that Saffie Joseph was not asked to leave Belmont Park nor were any of his horses. Further, Mr. Robertson advised that NYRA has taken no action against Saffie Joseph and that his license to train is in good standing in New York. We updated this article immediately to reflect the same." "NYRA vice president for communications Patrick McKenna: “Mr. Joseph has no horses stabled at Belmont Park and, to our understanding, is not currently planning on shipping horses to New York or entering races at Belmont Park while the matter is under investigation." Apparently the orig. article got it wrong. Saffie has a stable at GS. Is only banned from CD and was not planning on having any horses at BEL.
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Post by cherokeescot on May 18, 2023 9:49:17 GMT -5
Btw Mr Robertson is Saffie Joseph’s lawyer .
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Post by mysaladdays on May 18, 2023 11:16:08 GMT -5
Btw Mr Robertson is Saffie Joseph’s lawyer . I was just posting for clarification. VP at NYRA appears to say that Saffie is not "officially banned" by them?
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Post by cherokeescot on May 18, 2023 11:42:30 GMT -5
So was I 😉
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Post by cherokeescot on May 18, 2023 12:12:26 GMT -5
At least one vet is talking. Will be a Cal trainer announced next. Are you referring to a recent bad test in KY? Mere speculation at the moment. Could be true or just some more Hong Kong phooey 😜
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ozzy
UpInClass Member
Posts: 850
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Post by ozzy on May 18, 2023 22:47:46 GMT -5
Are you referring to a recent bad test in KY? Mere speculation at the moment. Could be true or just some more Hong Kong phooey 😜 Leave something to the imagination Bev!!
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1hooper
UpInClass Steward
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Post by 1hooper on May 27, 2023 19:40:24 GMT -5
More scratches coming. This is biggest story at CD but keep an eye on the surfaces. Plenty of horsemen concerned, not Laurel level yet. DRF Stewards at Churchill Downs have granted a request by trainer Saffie Joseph Jr. to be allowed to scratch horses he trains from races at the track on Thursday and Friday, the Kentucky Horse Racing Commission said. Joseph also said that he intends to ask for permission to scratch three horses on the Saturday card, though not his entrant in the Kentucky Derby. They chose not to make the track safer the last two days. Too tight. Churchill Downs Incorporated released the following statement Saturday in response to questions about track safety during the meet: www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/churchill-downs-issues-statement-on-equine-fatalities/
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Post by merasmag on May 27, 2023 20:45:18 GMT -5
what bs-no apologies to their scapegoat(s) total dickheads who know no one at peta or in the media cares about cd until next may
and "fans" keep bitching about lasix and silly picograms which cd and the other brass luvs
now they get to start a whole other "league"
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ozzy
UpInClass Member
Posts: 850
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Post by ozzy on Jul 1, 2023 9:07:46 GMT -5
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Post by mysaladdays on Jul 3, 2023 10:04:17 GMT -5
This is a pretty common outcome? ....... from what I read, necropsies often can't find reasons?
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5wide
UpInClass Member
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Post by 5wide on Jul 4, 2023 16:35:46 GMT -5
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